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Arisaema Enthusiast Group (AEG) Discussion List (and other= Arisaema Enthusiast Group (AEG) Discussion List (and other=
Sun Mar 17 06:40:47 CET 2002

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From: irisman <irisman at AMERITECH.NET>
Subject: Re: hybridization,  planning?
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Ray,   In my framework, curiosity is probably never random.  It is always
directed., minimally toward finding out . The development of a hypothesis
(or plan) may not even be systematized until the first steps in hybridizi=ng
have occurred. I am used to hybridizing irises and  any rigid planning ca=n
be a disadvantage because the plants one hopes to cross just don't bloom
that year.  For me the planning is a very fluid issue, of necessity, with
sub-plans, and contingencies far too complex to put on paper. When one ha=s
already selected some 150 plants to work with, but some of which may not
survive, If they survive, they may not bloom..  If they bloom, they may n=ot
have pollen, or, the cross may not "take".  If there is seed, it may not
germinate,so one checks the seed, (if it has not rotted) and repeats the
cross and checks the seed the next year.  Is there an endosperm?    Is th=e
seed apparently viable?.  Can it be embryo-cultured ?    Is there data
already published on this cross.?    Has it been attempted before? Are
chromosome counts known?  If both plants are triploid,, or if one is dipl=oid
and the other tetraploid or pentaploid how much time do I want to waste?
These are the basic steps I have gone through (more or less) with every
cross for which I have seedlings coming along.

What one can do best, in may aspects of "scientific' investigation (and I
can legitimately) claim to have been trained as a scientist), is to be re=ady
to exploit the "chance" occurrence  and change plans  accordingly  rather
than develop a plan and go with it  blindly just because one has made it.

Penicillin was not discovered by developing a plan to find it., nor was
Angraecum sesquipedale discovered by setting out to find it., but having
found the orchid one could then surmise that a pollinator with an 8" tong=ue
existed to  do the job, and,  further, guess that it was a  night-flying
moth.     Planning is fine, but it is not a first step, for me., at least
,in the way I think you use the word.      Regards, Adam

, 2002 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: list responces, hybridization, and stuff.

> Adam,
> No criticism intended. "Everyone to their own taste", said the old woma=n
> as she kissed the cow.
> It's just that the audience is smaller for hydridization, thus the
> number and timing of answers ought to be smaller and slower. However, b=y
> now
> you have some replies.
> Before I get lost in philosophy, Arum has a very different growing seas=on
> from Arisaema.
> Arum is dormant from late spring until late fall and grows all winter.
> It's spathe colors and shapes
> are quite distinct from those of Arisaema. I recommend Peter Boyce book
> on Arum as a place
> to learn about this plant and Deni Bown's book on Aroids as a place to
> learn about
> the many aroids and how they differ. Back to philosophy .....
> I am acquainted with some of the worlds best hybridizers, Joe Gable -
> Azaleas/Rhododendron,
> Elwin Orton - Ilex, Cornus, et. al. and admire their work. In studying
> their methods one
> thing stands out - you need a plan. There should be a target improvemen=t
> (hardiness, flower color,
> etc.) for every cross and the parents should be chosen to improve the
> probability of success.
> Random crosses may be fun, but they're mostly a total waste of time and
> effort.
> For interspecific crosses, it helps if the chromosome counts are
> compatable.
> I guess I have trouble comprehending your curiosity. In deciding what
> color to paint
> my house, I don't see the wisdom of trying nearly every bucket of paint=I
> can find.
> Nor do I see the wisdom of trying to make a house that flys by crossing
> a house with an airplane. Crossing a house with a boat has a promising
> set
> of objectives. Maybe that's why it's already been done.
> Better to have a plan that takes into account all the properties we see=k
> to achieve.
> Random curiosity is just not interesting to me, but directed curiosity
> IS. I
> have been an inventor by trade and hold many patents.
> I very much like Wilbert's idea of seeking to improve the hardiness of =A.
> cordatum.
> I tried selecting seedlings and had some success, but not enough.
> Ray
> GRSJr at
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