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Arisaema Enthusiast Group (AEG) Discussion List (and other= Arisaema Enthusiast Group (AEG) Discussion List (and other=
Fri May 21 18:54:37 CEST 1999

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From: Wilbert Hetterscheid <hetter at WORLDONLINE.NL>
Subject: Re: Questions
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Dear Ray,

LOGIC??? Since when is taxonomy logical? O.k., inside joke. In fact there
ain't much logic in THAT part of taxonomy that deals with identifying
specimens. Logic gets in in other subdisciplines, but that's another stor=y.

I had hoped that the comments on the site with the photos would explain
things. Onviously not. So here goes (and this is for both the purple and
green "bockii", cause I don't know which one is #24):

1) statement/fact: the green one and purple one are the same species. The
only difference between the two is the colour of the spathe.

2) the purple one conforms 100% with Pampanini's Ar. engleri, ergo, the
green one is that "species" too.

3) Jin Murata claims that Ar. engleri and bockii are the same thing. Guy
Gusman disagrees.
Guy thinks the green plant is Ar. amurense, more particularly a form he s=aw
in Korea.
Jin Murata denies that this plant has anything to do with Ar. amurence bu=t
hasn't yet told me why.

The problem lies with the holotype specimen of Ar. bockii, which is a poo=r
specimen, hard to interpret. However hard it is, everyone (I prefer a
taxonomist) is free to claim what he/she thinks this bockii actually is.
Murata says it is the thing called engleri. Since the name Ar. bockii is
valid and older than Ar. engleri, the name should be bockii.

My thoughts I'll keep to me for now, but I have given the indication by
asking Roy to use the combination bockii/engleri for the two plants

I hope this is clear enough?

Cheers all,

-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: George R Stilwell, Jr. <grsjr at JUNO.COM>
Datum: maandag 17 mei 1999 20:35
Onderwerp: Questions

>Welcome home. Thanks for the great pictures you posted on Roy's Arisaema
>I'm really curious about your logic in dubing the Kaichen #24 as A.
>bockii. Would you
>enlighten us a bit about this?
><GRSJr at>
>You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
>Get completely free e-mail from Juno at
>or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]

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